Are you guilty of destroying our business?

Discussion in 'Hotshot Hauler' started by dodgerep, Nov 22, 2007.

  1. dodgerep

    dodgerep Well-Known Member

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    As the owner of a small company, I am constantly amazed at the ever changing rules and regulations in our industry, but more amazing to me is the number of people who think they are running legal and are not even in the neighborhood.

    Many times, the DOT officers we encounter in the scale houses as ignorant as the drivers I encounter. With new UCRA rules in effect, and the DOT regulations being handed back to state control, the rules are just going to be growing more confusing.

    So here are a couple things that I thought I should point out.

    First off, Hot Shot trucks run local and short mileage routes. If you are running out of state or more than 300 miles, you are a Trucking company.

    Secondly, anyone hauling for profit, even if you are taking your car to the race track and expect to win or compete professionally, (You are or could get paid) you are required to have a USDOT Number.

    If you are for hire in any capacity, even for delivering envelopes and you operate over a 300 mile radius of your home address, you are required to have a USDOT & a ICCMC number. The ICCMC Motor Carrier Number is required for anyone who hires their truck to someone else to carry cargo. If you are for Hire, You are required to have this number. The cost is about 300, but that is just the beginning.

    Progressive does not offer, nor have they ever offered Commercial trucking insurance and the Commercial insurance they do offer is not valid over 300 miles from your home base. There are no exceptions to that rule.

    USDOT requires a minimum of 750,000 Commercial insurance, and Pennsylvania requires 1,000,000 minimum.

    Cargo insurance is not Commercial Vehicle insurance. Lloyds of London underwrites over 80% of all cargo transported in the world, and is one of the 3 companies that offers cargo Insurance for Small Trucks or "Hot Shots". Insurance rund 6,000 - 8,000 per year per truck. If you are not paying in that neighborhood, you are probably not properly insured.

    PUlling oversized loads is another problem area. Anyone ANYONE, carry a cargo over 8'6" wide, or 13'6" tall is required by law to obtain oversized permits for transport on state or federal highways. This is for safety reasons and the permits are not expensive.

    Any Trailer or cargo over 14' wide is required to have Pilot Cars and escorts. This is expensive but getting caught with out them will probably put you into bankruptcy.

    Before you can legally operate, you must have COMPLETED a State Safety Audit by an officer of the Department of Transportation in your home state.
    This is where you will have a chance to find out how much we really don't know.

    In regards to sleepers on pick ups. There are two rules here, and you can do as you wish. This will mostly come down to company policy, so please make sure you check with your director of operations for the company poilicies.

    If you are in a pick up, your back seat, while sufficient for most, cannot be used for sleeper berth do to the width of it. It would have to be stretched wider. When you have completed your daily driving, you can log yourself off duty. When you are not on duty, you are not required by law to show where you slept, or if you stayed in a hotel. IF you choose to sleep in your truck, that is your own personal business and the only way this could be an issue, is if you were woken up in the middle of the night by a DOT officer who asked if you were on duty or off, and asked to see your log book, while legally you can win this case, you would probably still get a ticket and have to go to court, but this have never happened to me or any other driver I know.

    These are just a few rules and I will be more than happy to have myself or my compliance officer address any questions any of you may have.

    Tim Blondin
    www.waytogoGiddyupngo.com
     
  2. gbuddenhagen

    gbuddenhagen Well-Known Member

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    i was under the impression HOT SHOT was used for mini floats or just one tons regardless of how far you drive...my company is ISLAND HOTSHOT and i drive anywhere in the U.S. and CANADA, wether i am pulling my 47ft gn or someones bumper pull or gn...i am registered for 36000 total, got to go wife is screaming saying the turkey is ready, happy turkey day to everyone!!
     
  3. sshewins

    sshewins Well-Known Member

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    I googled UCR and I still have no idea what it is. One on-line company said for $500 they could get you your DOT and MC #'s and one other thing (sorry I forgot) and for bout $50 more they could get/do the UCR thing.

    For a long time I always thought 'hot shot' was a single axle straight truck with a 60" sleeper and a 20' box....that or a goofy movie. :D
     
  4. dodgerep

    dodgerep Well-Known Member

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  5. sshewins

    sshewins Well-Known Member

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    Ok, I get it now, UCRA replaces SSRS, which replaced bingo's. Got it.waytogo
     
  6. tosch88

    tosch88 Active Member

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    Tim,
    You are correct on everything but the oversize load statement on pilot cars. I will just add to your post. Each state has its own rules on how many pilot cars you need and what type of lighting and how many signs you need or flags. Each state has it's on Provisional Sheet, some states you need 1 pilot car, some two and up to three. Generally, over 12'6" wide to 14' wide one pilot, 14' to 16' wide two pilots. This is just general info however, each state has its own provisional. Some states like Indiana only require only 1 pilot in the rear on a 4 lane divided highway with a 16' wide, on the flip side W. Virginia you need 3 pilot cars for a 16' wide, In Minnesota they're rules are anything over 14'6 wide is considered a super wide load, which means you can move it only between the hours of 12:00 and 5:00 A.M. at night with either a police escort or Minnesota certified escorts. Hauling Oversize loads is not for people that want to run illegal, I was stopped once for my mirror extension not being out far enough, which voided my permit, which then I was wrote two tickets, one for mirrors not extending out to see to the rear of my trailer and being over width without a permit because my safety infraction voided my current permit. Not to mention having to wait for another permit to come just for not having the mirrors out another 6" on one side. Tim I understand you being upset with illegally operating drivers, however when getting started if you have no experience, there are a lot of misleading company's out there, even the Dot Officers sometimes have they're own interpretation of some of the laws. If you are getting started with a new company, feel free to pm me I would be glad to give some advice on what needs to happen. I just started my trucking company this year and had no help from anyone. It is very confusing for someone that hasn't been in the interstate hauling business. It is also very expensive to be legal. I haul oversize loads and only oversize loads so I have no choice but to be legal, I get stopped at nearly every open weigh station to be checked. To all the illegal operators that intentionally run that way I hope you feel good about destroying the trucking industry. I pay $12k plus, per vehicle a year for ins, I can't compete with illegals that don't have the ins. overhead.
     
  7. 9 second Butiac

    9 second Butiac Well-Known Member

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    you haven't purchased a permit to go from knoxville to memphis have ya. LOL

    you have hit the nail on the head there are so many that run illegal & it just gets me so upset when I see it & think that is how they can haul cheap freight. about 2 months ago I got hit with a $1,500 fine for being over on my permit, the funny thing was the DOT officer was the same one I had for my DOT audit.rotfl
     
  8. Stroker548

    Stroker548 Member

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    Where do the people that transport travel trailers fall? I am going to lease my truck to a company for MY profit, hauling their cargo. In live in Ohio and dont even need a CDL if I stay under 26,001 pounds. Will the company I lease on with provide me with the correct USDOT number? Also, I haul my race car trailer on some weekends. Do I have to get a different number for that? I am new to this game so I think I have a lot to learn. Thanks in advance!waytogo
     
  9. 9 second Butiac

    9 second Butiac Well-Known Member

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    I do not know the laws in Slowhio but in NC if you are tagged for 26,000 or less BUT towing in excess of 10,000 lbs you must have a class A drivers license NOT a class A CDL but a class A drivers license. I had a DOT audit about 1 year ago & my wife needs to get a class A to drive my dually, for towing our enclosed car trailer.
     
  10. Stroker548

    Stroker548 Member

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    That sounds just like Indiana. They call it a Chauffer liscense. Here in Slowhio:) all we need is our Class D operator liscense for up to 26,000. I think they should probly set the bar a little higher myself, but thats what they told me.
     
  11. tosch88

    tosch88 Active Member

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    It has nothing to do with the weight your towing as to what license you need. Nor does it matter what you have your vehicle plated at for weight. This is the law, does you GCWR exceed 26001. Take the manufactures spec sheet (located in your door jam and on the front of your trailer) and add the GVW of both the truck and trailer together. If it exceeds 26k combined you need a Class A CDL and a medical card to travel interstate. If they exceed 10k but are not over 26k you need a chauffers license. These are federally mandated laws for interstate commercial driving. I hope this clears some things up for you guyswaytogo
     
  12. 9 second Butiac

    9 second Butiac Well-Known Member

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    tosch88 I don't want to start a pissing match on this but there are federal laws then there are state laws. the states are are able to add amendments to federal laws to make the law stronger (if I'm wording it correctly). I always thought the same as you, the federal laws take priority, but was I wrong, I learned that in a Georgia scale house. I don't claim to know it all and if there is anyone that does claim to know it all they are a fool. heck a good veteran from DOT will even tell you he don't know all the laws. many states are different. that is why many of us O/O have said that it should be completely handled by the fed's & not leave it up to the states.
     
  13. tosch88

    tosch88 Active Member

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    I agree with thatwaytogoI thought you guys were talking about interstate travel not intrastate. My bad! Sorry for sounding like a ****:confused:
     
  14. dodgerep

    dodgerep Well-Known Member

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    While it is true that each state has different requirements for both Permits and for Drivers License requirements, the general rule is this.

    26,001 and under: No CDL license required (that is why people can rent uhauls). While many DOT officers are not clear on this rule, it is your responsibility to know the FMCSA hand book and carry a copy of it in your vehicle at all times.

    Oversized loads: While the laws state clearly that anything 8'6" (102") wide is legal, it also states that you are allowed =/-4" to each side, which gives you a legal non permitted load width of 110".
    Many RV Transporters have been ticketed wrongly because the tow unit has an awning. This puts you over and if you don't know the law, they will take your money gladly. I have transported oversized loads in just about every state and have do not transport over 14' for the reason that I am not going to pay a pilot car 1.30+ per mile. Too much paper work and besides, they slow me down ;)

    The most difficult permits are Louisiana because they never answer the phone and you better plan ahead.

    UCR: Yes, UCRA has replaced SSR and it is past due if you have not done it yet.

    RV Transporters: The truth is, if you want to make little money for your time, and don't mind kissing some guy or gals butt in Indiana or there abouts....IF you don't mind about 40% of your miles empty and you agree with back hauls, then RV transporting is the deal for you. If you want to run your own business, be your own boss and Make an honest days wage for an honest days work, then Stay away from companies like Horizon, Quality, and the other RV Transport companies that have contributed to the decline in rates for all hot shot or small truck trucking companies.
     
  15. sshewins

    sshewins Well-Known Member

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    Another thing to consider is this: Are you good at finding loads/generating the work? I know that is a MAJOR weakness I have. In order to have the work you have to be able to make the contacts, know the people, know where to look, know HOW to look. The majority of companies shown in Overdrive or LandLine and such are in the $1.20 to $1.50 range (some higher, some lower) and are in class 8's where you get 5-7MPG and have your own trailer. Yes, there are companies that are paying in the $2 - $3 per mile range, BUT finding them AND them actually wanting you to haul something is almost like trying to find a needle in a haystack (for people like me) I know I work better DOING the work than FINDING the work.

    That is why hauling at the $1.50 to $2.00 range sounds so appealing. (Even if its only one way) Especially when the truck has the potential of 10 + MPG and half the payment, tires cost less, brakes too etc..
     
  16. dodgerep

    dodgerep Well-Known Member

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  17. strictlyv8

    strictlyv8 Well-Known Member

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    I am just glad that all the hauling I do is for my own Roofing Company. I throw away all my own trash and use a 10 ton or a 7 ton dump trailer. I do have a CDL just in case. I just don't have the air Brake Endorsement.
     
  18. haulin-rv

    haulin-rv Well-Known Member

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    Ok I know your independent and spend a bunch of money to do that, but don't trash on other ways of making a living driving.

    I am an RV HAULER, I DON'T kiss anyones butt, I DO make a living (been for 5 years).

    I work hard for the company I am leased to and I keep busy when I want to. I have no need to kiss anybodys butt, actually its more the other way around. They tend to call me, since I work hard and am a reliable and safe driver. I do make a living, no I am not a retired person supplementing my income. I am a 39 year old guy with a wife 2 kids and a mortgage. I also am home every weekend and usually a couple nights during the week, I run mostly the midwest, and southeast, ok, tx, and so on. Am I going to get rich..NO, but I enjoy what I do and it fits me just fine.

    BTW I make an HONEST wage.
     
  19. Brisk

    Brisk Well-Known Member

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    Haulin...If you dont mind me asking what company do you lease to??
     
  20. dodgerep

    dodgerep Well-Known Member

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    It was not nor is it my intention to insult anyone, I have however a much different view of the RV Transport Companies for a few reasons. While these reasons may not apply to you, they do apply to most. Please don't take my post personally.

    Most RV Transport companies, i.e. Horizon Transport, have 1 truck listed on the USDOT FMCSA. they make a lot of money sending drivers from Indiana to Where ever and most of those driver, 70%, return empty to get the next load. They make between .92 - 1.05 on average and while some drivers do get loaded back, most do not. These drivers usually resort to hauling loads "Under the Table" without insurance to cover the cargo and without legal Operating authority.

    These drivers usually book on sites such as USHIP and undercut each other to the point that it is not uncommon for customers to call and quote a USHIP price quote to see i I will lower my rate.

    I take pride in the fact my drivers make an average of over 7,000 a month (-taxes of about 1600 a year) take home. They drive nice trucks, they have fun and we don't run the same route over and over. Most of my customers are private individuals who have been put off of web sites like USHIP and come seeking a reputable, properly insured carrier who will deliver on the promises we have made to them.

    Back haul rates were started by hot shot drivers looking to cover their expenses going home and they are not common language. If you drivers who do this for a living want to help, then you need to be more vocal on or against the drivers who are driving around with NO DOT #, NO ICCMC # and who haul oversized and illegal loads with no regard for safety or the law. I am not saying that all the laws we have to deal with are fair, but they are the laws until they are changed.
     

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